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Zac Ziegler: I'm Zac Ziegler, and this is Oregon Rainmakers from KLCC. On this edition, I talk with the co founders of tiny home manufacturing company Tru Form Tiny.
You don't need to be an architecture geek or a minimalist to be enticed by the pictures of tiny homes that pop up on the internet. The structures pack much of what is found in a regular house in spaces that often aren't much bigger than 400 square feet, making the most of the limited space through unique solutions for storage, bedding and other amenities. The algorithm figured out my interest in the design of these homes years ago, and I was surprised to learn that one of the manufacturers I had often seen, Tru Form Tiny, was located here in Eugene. So, I recently headed to their offices and manufacturing facility in West Eugene to learn more about the design and building of these homes, and meet the couple who co-founded the company, Malia Schultheis and Jen Carroll. As my tour started, they told me about how they got into the industry. Malia leads off.
Malia Schultheis: I double majored in accounting and fine art and so and I've always loved interior design. I actually was doing some consulting for Jen's contracting company many, many years ago, and we got together, had a baby, decided maybe we should do this tiny home thing. We actually had the opportunity to build a couple of tiny homes for an architect that had designed some and we fell in love with it. It was really fun, and they were just so cute. And so we designed one of our own and built it, bootstrapped it, and then put it out there into the world, and found out that people really liked it. They liked our style. And so here we are.
Jen Caroll: And so now we're at 10 years. So we're celebrating our 10 year anniversary this year, and that community of tiny house builders ebbs and flows over the years, and the more that we stick around and show what we do, it's really driving the design and the experience of tiny houses, is Tru Form, the company that's in your backyard, if you're here in Eugene and Springfield area. So it's really cool to kind of share that, but that that kind of authority in this space is our design and our feeling and our textures, and everything that you go into a tiny house is thought about, so everything from storage to fixtures and how they move and all that. But this is our world, right? So we just get saturated in that world, and we love all the little details. And luckily, someone like Malia can put it all together with like colors and textures and hold this, hold this vision that we have, and then we've created.
Schultheis: Yeah, I get really inspired by traditional architecture. And so we try to really make these feel like homes, rather than little shoe boxes, because basically they are shoe boxes, but then adding interesting little architectural elements make them really beautiful,
Ziegler: Yeah, make some really fun shoe boxes.
Caroll: That's right, yeah. So let's walk around. So this one that's in front of us is it just came over from the framing side, from the south building, and it's actually a new model for us, and it's a toned down kind of kitchen size. So it's a smaller kitchen, which makes it more affordable, but we kept the downstairs living. So there's no lofts, which also makes it more affordable. But there's a downstairs bed with storage. There's a nice sized bathroom, and then also we have this really cool front porch, which you can- it's not there now- but you can envision this space: a nice 6-foot-by-10-foot front porch. So believe it or not, a lot of people in the tiny house space love the idea of either a drop down porch or an attached porch. They just want to have it show up and everything works, and it's turnkey and and have all these little items that in a large, multi-million dollar house you get, but also in this toned down style, you get these little gems that create that experience of, it's custom, it's well built. It's, you know, sturdy. It's, like, really enjoyable to be in.
Ziegler: Yeah, you can look at it, and just already you see the porch swing, the couple of Adirondack chairs, something along those lines, gives you that homey feel to start.
Caroll: And it's a really simple design too. So again, we play with that affordability, but also, where's the design intent? There's a lot of sighting detail that's not up yet on this one, but that will kind of show kind of a differentiation of what that, that's about,
Schultheis: Yeah, this is a new model for us, so we're trying out something new with it.
Caroll: And so now we kind of pass through the inventory space, and here's one unit. We'll take a peek, and it's cool. It's within two days of leaving, yeah? So you can just get a feeling of what this model brings us. This is one of our our most popular model, really, for this size. So it's a just under 400-square-foot tiny house. That is how big we can make it. We can't make it any bigger. It's part of the park model code. So we pack everything into 400-square -feet. A lot of times people come to us and say, Hey, what's the largest tiny house you can build? And you're like, Okay, is that a thing?
Ziegler: It's a bit of an oxymoron.
Schultheis: Yeah. So now we're starting to connect them too. So build two big, giant, tiny homes and have them connected by a porch. And so then now you're with lofts getting up to about 1,000-square-feet. Yeah, 1,000-square-feet.
Caroll: So we're just using the same concept on on tiny living and adding a bedroom and adding but still having things on the small scale, right? So which is kind of the whole point, I believe, of tiny house, tiny house living. So right now we're in the bedroom. You can imagine a headboard with a bed here, and there's some closet space, beautiful doors. I mean, I can point out a lot of things here that I get excited about. This is a custom built Tansu staircase, so it has all storage in the staircase. There will be a railing right here that is in powder coat right now, and will go up to a loft, and the loft is really big, and it's the one space that can be flexible so you could have sleeping spaces. You could have two beds up there, like kiddo beds, or it could be a storage area.
Ziegler: You got to be that little bit shorter to fit up there. But yeah, kids probably love it. They love a nice, cozy, tight space. You know, I saw that with my daughter when she was little.
Caroll: Yeah, we're just passing the bathroom here. It's a full size bathroom. There could be a bathtub, there could be shower. We have a lot of tile options. And then here's our kitchen and living space. So there's different options we have. This client chose, oh, things like this island has storage in it. We could have a table.
Schultheis: There’s a lot coming out there with storage. We offer a lot of architectural different configurations for suggested floor plans. But we also do completely custom start with absolutely nothing, just an idea, maybe some Pinterest photos with the client, and then design something completely around their vision and needs, just their living needs.
Ziegler: Who's a typical customer for you all? Are these maybe small families' primary residence? Is this someone's weekend getaway? What are people looking for when they come to you?
Schultheis: All of the above, and the industry has shifted a lot. When we first started, people really did want them to be tinier, and it was oftentimes just individuals, empty nesters, sort of older individuals, 60s and older, but now it's because of the housing crisis. After COVID and everything, we are getting a lot of younger families, people starting out and people wanting a nice home. And this gives people the opportunity to truly design, custom design, a home for themselves and do all the things they've ever wanted within a tinier framework. But it's usually those younger families and then older folks that are downsizing now, maybe their kids have moved out. And then, yes, going, you know, having a vacation spot. Hospitality, people creating experiences for people to go skiing and then stay in little cabins and tiny homes.
Ziegler: Yeah, little Airbnb kind of set up on some property. They've got a few of these, maybe.
Schultheis: These are really because of our style. We do really well in the hospitality space. People are able to make destination experiences that do really well. And Airbnb, and so we've sold a lot of Airbnb.
Caroll: We had a recent client, her daughter just had a baby, but she didn't want to impact their household. It was a small house, and so she actually bought a tiny house from us and parked it in the backyard, and she flies in and spends a month with the family, and she has her own space, and then she goes to other her main house, or travels, so it's just gives flexibility, and there's still that family element where you're in this space, you're not in a hotel or something like that.
Ziegler: Yeah, it's the proverbial mother-in-law quarters that they've got their own spot at the end of the day.
Caroll: I think a really cool thread of our clientele that over the years, is they're just creative people. When people are thinking about tiny houses, they want to make a change in their life a lot of times, and that could be a downsizing. You know, I want to travel more. I don't want to do all this upkeep on this 2,500-square-foot house anymore. So I'm going to downsize, simplify my life sometimes, like Malia was just saying, just like, how do we get our kids a place to stay and they're comfortable? And, you know, just getting creative. And so we love to hear the stories, but also it feels really good to be part of that journey. And again, creating. And it's not just a box. It's like creating a really nice, livable space.
Ziegler: Yeah, let's, let's mosey on a little more.
Caroll: So production guy here, what I like to point out as we walk around is this looks like a residential home when we're outside this tiny house, and it's painted and it's caulked and we spend a lot of energy on making sure that this is watertight. Our roofs are 40 year warrantied metal roof, typically, and that's just on the material, but they're a lifetime roof. They're not going anywhere. That's just if the paint fades or something. So we actually invest more money than, let's say, standard code, residential code, into making sure water doesn't go into the house, because the eaves are not big, right? So there's a lot of exposure here. So we want to make sure everything is tight and dialed in.
Ziegler: So you mentioned the metal roofs. And being that I've spent some time as a wildfire reporter, my brain instantly goes to like, fire-wising stuff is, is that a concern? Because I'm guessing a decent number of these are ending up out in nature, someone's weekend getaway.
Caroll: Yeah, it is. It is. It's definitely part of the conversation. We built quite a few tiny homes for people that have had wildfire kind of situations where their primary home has burnt down, or things like that. So metal roofs are a standard for us. It does help in fire, like a fire prevention. If that wildfire, it comes right to the house, it's gonna burn just like any other house, but any kind of, like embers that are floating through the air, it does really well kind of preventing that. Yeah, it's in the biggest thing is it's on wheels. So if you have time, you could hook it up to your your rig, and pull it away. So there's always plan B, which usually there isn't a Plan B, on fire, fire prevention.
Ziegler: Yeah. Those evacuation notices don't quite come with that amount of time with the move your house time. But in this instance, yeah, you might be able to.
Caroll: Yeah, there's a couple of things you have to be prepared for, but you do have that opportunity. So we're just walking into the South building, we call it, and right into our woodworking area. This is where we do a lot of like this table right here. We build this just from wood. So it's nothing special, but it's definitely a woodworking project. So yeah, and just, a nice scale, I'm going to walk through a little bit into our cabinet shop. And this is where we do our kitchen cabinets and all our finishing. So we have two people building kitchens. We put out a kitchen almost every week, or even under a week, and then all the finishing happens right next to it.
Ziegler: Yeah, well, and I'm guessing you have the ability to get things in exactly the size you want, that they're being built to your size. You're not designing around what someone offers.
Schultheis: Yep, that's major.
Caroll: So we're now building our chassis in house, and here's an example of one of our chassis. So we have two guys here working on them, and this is our foundation, right? So we don't skimp on this stuff. Steel does act differently than concrete, so there's a couple things that we work with our clients on, but having a really good foundation is just as important as as any kind of residential home that you can think of. So we we we put enough energy and material in there to make sure everything's nice and flat.
Ziegler: So earlier, you did mention like you know, people are are tending towards this due to housing shortages and and affordability issues. I mean, how does this compare to building just a standard house? As far as those, those costs?
Schultheis: Well, I'll say, first of all, this square footage price is more because more of the percentage of the home is kitchen and bathroom and built in with all the cabinetry and stuff. So it's highly built out, whereas in a normal home, or a larger home on a foundation, you have a lot of open, big, open space that's not being built in as densely. So you'll find that that when you're trying to calculate square footage, price, it's a lot higher, but this the smaller square foot is more affordable in general, and they're higher quality. A lot of times, when you're moving into a home that's 30-40, years old, it's oftentimes got a lot of problems, and so it's nice to buy a new home.
Ziegler: Oh yeah. When I moved here, I moved into an early 90s build and it's like, 'Oh yeah, okay, we need money for the floors and the HVAC needs updating.' So I can imagine.
Caroll: On square foot price too, it's just that's your biggest savings. If you're building a residential home or if you're building a tiny house, if you can pare it down just a little bit, you know, square foot cost money. So the smaller you get, the cheaper it is, and you can keep that kitchen and that nice kind of finish and those little upgrades that are important to you. Yeah, we're gonna walk through. So So we've kind of made our way through the initial part, and we're going to turn our corner here, and this is where our production is. So where we start from scratch, our chassis get leveled up, and then we build the walls and go from there.
Schultheis: Yeah. So right now we're framing. We have, let's see how many units over on this side right now, four really big ones.
Caroll: So this space actually is where we started in this building. So you can imagine all phases being in about a quarter of the space we have now. And so it was a lot of a lot more activity in this space when that was going on. But now we've turned this into our our rough in phases, and we have one being framed up. The roof is going on right now, and the other one is just getting through utilities and insulation. And then, of course, as the inside is being worked, on the outside is also getting wrapped and prepped for siding and windows. And then we have one chassis here in front of us that has to go to paint. We actually paint our chassis off site. And then there's two that are coming back in, and that's going to start next week, and so you'll see two more starting up.
Ziegler: So you guys are doing so much work here that is often subcontracted by different companies, and it's a lot of skilled labor. How is it getting the staffing that you need? Can that be be a tricky proposition, or how's that run for you?
Caroll: Short answer, yes. So I would say, over the years, it's ebbed and flowed, just like any other kind of staffing needs. Right now, we're just over 50 people. Everything's in house, electrical, plumbing, HVAC, roofing, so every single phase is in house, and we do that. Again, quality control is a major one. Scheduling is the other one. So when you're dealing with manufacturing and production, you can't have stuff stay on the floor and just not being worked on, so we really have to schedule all the phases out. So that's really important. In terms of our staff ,we have a really great core staff that's been here for quite a quite a long time. Some people do move on, life changes, and we always hire and promote from within. We actually have a need. Right now, we're at about 50. We're looking at three to five people to fill some spaces so where our ads are out, and we're getting resumes and all that. So you know, if this is something that is interest, definitely check us out. But even if it's not this period of time where we need some people. We're always looking for quality folks. Timing is a big one, but getting a good quality person in here is important, as you can see also, tiny houses, everybody's there right next to each other, right?
Ziegler: You better like your co workers.
Caroll: Exactly.
Schultheis: Company culture is really important to us. And like you said, we have just a couple people in a department, like in welding, we have two really strong people, and we're really a big family. We all just really care a lot about each other.
Ziegler: And I'm guessing there are certain professions, like, man, you probably can just go to someone who's used to doing framing and being like, hey, how would you like to do your job on a smaller scale indoors? And they're like, Oh, yes, please. Where do I sign up that advantage of being inside has to be there.
Schultheis: Yes. We've also had employees want to change their trade. So for instance, somebody working in painting says, I'd like to try something new. And so now they're working in electrical and utilities, which is a huge, a huge jump into another profession, profession.
Caroll: So there's lots of opportunity with that. We're really hiring for personality and for work ethic, and there's slots that we can train. There's also people that have been working 20 years plus in the trades, and go, you know, it would be great to just show up the same spot. Have a nice, steady workflow, be treated professionally. Be respected and be part of this team that's making these beautiful homes, and we take pictures outside of our finished homes, and everybody's in front of them. I wish our clients could see the people that are working. So we try to give them pictures and connections. And, oh, this- not too long ago, one of our clients sent 30 bagels with like, five different cream cheeses, and just like, 'hey, I just appreciated everybody working on our space'. And so it's really important to have that connection. I mean, our clients are so important for this business. They're number one, and our employees are so important because the people that are creating these two things
Schultheis: We have a lot of women in the trades here too, which is really nice, and they feel very safe. So that's really important to us.
Ziegler: So how long does it typically take to get a tiny home from chassis to sitting somewhere and someone moving their stuff in?
Caroll: So once the chassis essentially arrives here, ready to be built on 90 days, is our our slotted time.
Ziegler: Wow.
Caroll: So 90 days we can have it out the door, if we have the same unit going out, we can even get less. So it could even go to 80, even under 80. But I would plan on around 90. The process before the actually signing a contract can take anywhere from one week, which, if you're really having a deadline and you're really motivated to it's averaging around like three or four weeks. So it's not a huge amount of design time and planning time. And then once the signed contract, we slot it into production. 90 days later, it's delivered. And then another big thing about tiny houses, there's no permits. So if you can park a travel trailer or an RV, or a park model RV, and use it in your in your area this, that's what this is. So you you might have to have a permit to get a pedestal for electrical hookup, but it's all the electrical, plumbing, HVAC stuff is all just like an RV park.
Schultheis: So it's very popular in California, because it's taking them over a year to get through the permitting process and approvals and things to be able to build a home on a on a traditional foundation. And so tiny homes are are legal down there because of the housing crisis, it's legal to live in them full time. And so this is a really great solution for people that are trying to move quickly and have a home.
Ziegler: Yeah, there's probably plenty of folks who now own a lot in Altadena who are thinking this looks like an absolutely great idea, if for nothing else, while they navigate that crazy process of rebuilding. So we've talked about the housing crisis a few times. I wonder if you have thoughts on how processes is like this, how tiny homes could help get us through some of that crunch? Do you think it's a solid option that that more people need to be exploring, more communities need to be exploring?
Schultheis: Absolutely, and there's all different kinds of builders out there. We're more luxury builder. We do a higher quality product, but there's people that are building a little bit differently and a little more affordably and so and smaller. Probably it went from just couple dozen builders, when we first started, maybe a dozen builders, to hundreds of builders out there now across the country.
Ziegler: Great, well, thank you too very much for showing me around today.
Caroll: Our pleasure. No, we definitely enjoy opening up our doors to and again, Eugene-Springfield, area specifically. So many times people say, 'Hey, I had no idea you guys are here'. So, yeah, we're here. Yeah, building tiny houses.
Ziegler: That was Jen Carroll and Malia Schultheis of Tru Form Tiny. This has been Oregon Rainmakers from KLCC. I'm Zac Ziegler. Thanks for listening.
