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MICHAEL DUNNE: I'm Michael Dunne, perhaps now more than ever, the very idea of exchange students is vital to understanding and respect for different cultures. Think about it. If more young Americans could go and live with families in different countries, and more foreign-born people could come and experience America, just think what it could do for global peace and prosperity today on the show, you'll get a small glimpse on the importance of the exchange student movement. You'll hear from a Ukrainian student who's been living with a family in Eugene, and a young Eugenian who spent time in France. You'll also hear from the adult volunteer from the organization that puts it all together. It's a great window into how shared experiences can make a better world. Paul Primak, a volunteer with AFS American Field Services and exchange students, Iruna Chopuk, from Ukraine, and Renata Russell from Eugene, who was studying or was an exchange student in France. Welcome to you all. Thanks so much for coming on the program.
ALL: Thank you.
MICHAEL DUNNE: Paul. I'm going to start with you. This is international student week, International Education Week and you're a volunteer with AFS. Tell us what AFS does.
PAUL PRIMAK: Well, AFS is a placement organization. They work with a number of different organizations, and they're recognized by the Department of State to issue exchange visitor visas, the j1 visa, which is an important thing, but their history is very interesting. I think they started as ambulance drivers, volunteer ambulance drivers during World War One and World War Two and after they were no longer really needed as ambulance drivers, they sort of morphed into a student exchange organization with the idea of promoting world peace through direct Contact to what we now call public diplomacy. So AFS has been active for many, many years in two different forms. And one of the interesting things about AFS USA is that it's part of an international organization with over 60 AFS partners around the world and over 50,000 volunteers.
MICHAEL DUNNE: Renata, I'm going to go to you, you know, tell our audience what it was like being in France, and what were some of the, you know, differences that you noticed right away, other than, obviously, the language and certainly a much larger city, or, well, I shouldn't say that, because I know you were in a small, small town, but very different from Eugene. Talk about sort of what it was like to be there and maybe how long it took you to kind of get over the differences.
RENATA RUSSELL: For me, being in France was an absolute dream, because since I was really little, I wanted to learn French and go to Paris, just kind of seeing those things in the movies. And so, I remember landing in Paris and going with the other exchange students on a boat on the Sand River, and just seeing the Eiffel Tower with that music playing. I could see people dancing on the streets as you pass by, and they're waving to you from the bank, and it was a really magical moment for me. And I had an amazing host family with a mom originally from Romania, and then a French dad, and they really helped me a lot with the language, the culture, and getting adjusted at school. And it took me about a couple weeks for me to start feeling comfortable, because even at school, I was just really overwhelmed at first with the language, because the professors would like to write things on the board. I didn't know what they were saying, and I was struggling with vocabulary to communicate with my new peers. But honestly, I was really lucky to find friends, and they helped me a lot with language, with just buying things at the store. And, yeah, I think after the first couple of weeks, I started to feel better. Then after the first three months, it started to feel really like home.
MICHAEL DUNNE: Great, great. Paul, maybe talk a little bit about how your organization gets these young people ready for the journey overseas or to come from overseas. Here, what are some of the things that an organization like, like, like AFS does to prepare them because, again, you're talking about language barrier, culture shocks, that sort of a thing,
PAUL PRIMAK: Sure. One of the things that exchange organizations must do to participate in the J-1 program is to have a documented preparation sequence. And so, you know, the programs are competitive. The scholarship programs are super competitive. The core programs, like the one that Renata participated in, are still very competitive. And you know, we go through an interview process, there's obviously, there's an application. Prior to that, the student makes it to the interview process. AFS will then nominate them to the host country, and the students then go through an orientation. Part of its online. Part of it is in person. It starts in the US and in the situation where Renata was, and then it continues in the host country, wherever that might be around the world. And then for AFS, there's also a monthly check in for students in it. I'm Irina's liaison, and I check in with her monthly. I check in with her host family monthly, I check in with their school, just to make sure that things are going well. And at the end of the program, and this is probably the most important, there's a reentry process, because readjusting to the home country is often more challenging for students than the host country, in the sense that, you know, everybody expects things to be different when they go to France or when they come to the US, but they don't expect the challenges of coming home after this great experience they've had.
MICHAEL DUNNE: Iruna, I'm going to go to you. You know what was for you, what was the biggest challenge coming to the US? Maybe it was language or something like that. But I'm also wondering, just in terms of, you know, getting used to a country like the US, which is obviously well known around the world, beloved and hated. I just wonder if there was, you know, this sort of difficulty in coming to a place that, like I said, is kind of, in many ways, sort of center stage on the global scene.
IRUNA CHOPUK: I think it's the most difficult, I feel it's like settling down, like settle down here used to this place that everyone speak another language, and there is no my own language. And I think it's that I need to learn how to just do some like, I need to learn how to just go and do something when, for example, oh, I, I, my goal is to meet new friends. Yeah, I just come to someone. Hey, how are you? Let's like and talk more and, yeah, just involved, be involved in this community. I think it's the most like an important thing for me.
MICHAEL DUNNE: Renata, kind of the same question for you. When you were in France, did you, did you find that people, oh, she's American, we need to talk to her. Or kind of, was it, was there some initial shyness, both on your own part, but also in the people that you were? You were meeting and having, you know, conversations with?
RENATA RUSSELL: Yeah, I think definitely, being from the United States is a big kind of, like, excitement factor for a lot of people. They are really interested and learning if you watch the same shows as they do, because they grew up on American television. Also, they are really interested in seeing if you listen to the same music, if you if, like, there are really, like, yellow school buses, because that's like a thing. They think that's a myth. And I was like, No, that's actually true. And they're like, Oh, it's so cool. Um, so just like, little things like that, learning that they are having questions about food, like, do we eat, like, hot dogs at baseball games, how football games are? Like, a lot of questions of like, high school cheerleaders and football guys, and if all of that is true? Um, so yeah, I think there's a lot of interest in the US, and kind of like debunking some myths about the US, but also, like reinforcing some things. And yeah, I think even my history teacher there, whenever he would bring up the us in the conversation, he'd be like, Okay, so now we're not to have our example. And I'd be like, Okay, we're just going to go now. But yeah, I think it was definitely a great conversation starter. And to be able to talk with people from France about just our cultural differences or things that we think alike on was really interesting.
MICHAEL DUNNE: Yeah, Iruna, I want to go back to you in terms of, you know, obviously, you know, flying across the world to come from Ukraine to Oregon, how much preparation did you do? How much English Did You Know Before You Made this journey and sort of, you know, how much did you sort of know about American culture before you actually, you know, did this exchange program?
IRUNA CHOPUK: I started learning English when I was in first grade or second. It was like 10 years ago, and I just learned it, yeah, 10 years ago. So, my English are not the best, but it's on a basic level that they can talk with, talk with people about preparation before I came my program did a lot of likes events that I can learn about what I need to expect about us, but through them my life, I also, like was searching internet and just use a social media. So, I know that, like in US, you have like a cheerleader at this football game, which means it's really excited about it. Also, that, like, this is, as Renata says, it's yellow school buses. It's also some things that are, oh, it's yes, yeah, and yeah. So I was, I'm think I was really prepared to the difference that it here will be. So, I think that I didn't have, like, a cultural shock.
MICHAEL DUNNE: Renata, I'm going to go back to you when you went to France, was there, was there an occurrence, an event, just a just a general happening that you thought, boy, this is going to be really difficult. It's going to be very different. And you were really surprised, like, Oh, wow. I had no idea that they would think the way that I do, being my age, there moments where you're like, Wow. You know what? International you know, barriers aren't applicable right now. I'm just, you know, a young person just in a different place?
RENATA RUSSELL: Yeah, I think something that, for me initially was hard, like a kind of a culture shock. But I knew they used the public transportation system a lot, but I didn't know, like, just how much. And so, after my host, mom would drive me to school for like, the first week, she was like, Okay, now you're ready to use the bus. And I was like, Okay. And so, I would have to walk from my house to the bus stop and take the bus to, like, the castle, which for them, is just normal. There's like a castle in the middle of the city, and then from the castle, I would walk another 10 minutes to get to my high school, and I was really nervous. I was kind of following people with backpacks on and just hope they were going to the same high school I was, and I really didn't think that I would be using the public transportation system as much as I did, I thought it'd be okay, maybe just like to school once in a while, but no, I used it like every day. I used it just to get around the city to, like taking busses to other side of town, or taking the tram to go to, like a shopping center, or even I took the train to go from my city anger to Paris, and I was like, oh, okay, I can take the train. I can go take the train over here to the coast. And I did that one time with my friend, and we actually it was a whole like thing that we got lost and the trains weren't working. And then we found another group of French kids, and they helped us out. There were some elderly French ladies who are helping us out, like trying to get us into first class on a train on the way back. And it's just really fun to kind of have these hiccups and just work them out, and they're all part of the exchange experience. And it was a real adventure, I think, to find other French kids who are also struggling with the transportation system, and they're like, Yeah, we get it. We'll show you. And I think it was just like a lot of moments of bonding like that.
MICHAEL DUNNE: Paul, really quickly go to you, you know, I know one of the goals from the organization is to promote peace and understanding. And, yeah, I'd like to give you the opportunity to talk about, you know, here we are talking to two wonderful young people who are, you know, exchange students in very different places, talking about that message of understanding and peace.
PAUL PRIMAK: Well, you know, I think it, it all sort of boils down. From my observation, it boils down to personal contact and getting below the surface in a different culture. Both the arena and Renata spent extended time in a different culture, and it wasn't a tourist experience. And so, you know, it was a day to day, you know, work it out, figure it out. And that's the reason I got involved with AFS in their long-term programs. I I worked for 35 years in international education for the Oregon University system, both at the U of O and OSU. And one of the things that I always was impressed with when students came to our programs and they had been on an exchange program in high school, they were by far the most mature, confident, resilient students that we had. And what that leads me to say is that their accomplishments and their ability to work through issues and engage in a meaningful way, in a much deeper way than simply being a tourist, is what this is all about. And I know people who are in their 70s or 80s who have done programs through AFS or other organizations who have carried these experiences through their whole lives.
MICHAEL DUNNE: Iruna, I'm going to go to you when you go back home, what is maybe the most important for you, the most significant either experience or understanding that you'll bring back home with you about your experience being here in Oregon and in the United States?
IRUNA CHOPUK: I think It's to bring back culture that I learned here, like about people, that is it lived here that just to talk more about us in my community in Ukraine. But still, I'm here, not so long time. So I think my, my learning of us are still in progress.
MICHAEL DUNNE: Renata kind of has the same question for you. You know, coming back from France, what was the thing that you really felt the most cherished that you brought back home with you to Eugene.
RENATA RUSSELL: For me, I think it was really my international friendships that I established while in France. Because, well, not only did I make French friends, but I also made friends from other countries in the world that I met, because we're all international students, like from AFS in France. We're called kind of lost. We're like in the beginning, bonding over things that we're going through. And I've met, I have close friends from Italy, from Turkey, from Scandinavian countries, and from countries in Latin America that I'm still in contact with, and we invite each other over, like, anytime you want to come over and visit, there's always, like, a place for you. There's always going to be somewhere you can come and feel safe, and we'll welcome you. And I think that that for me is something I'm really going to cherish forever, is, yeah, the friendships I've made, the connection with French people that I have could because right now I'm looking at maybe going over to France, like, looking for universities, and just the things that they've taught me about having work life balance, to go out and, like, sit at one of their Thera sits, like, outside of a restaurant and, like, have a drink with some friends and just talk about life. And I think, yeah, it really opened me up to different ways of looking at the world. And like, just taking a moment to, like, sit back and relax and just like, enjoy what other cultures have to offer you.
MICHAEL DUNNE: Terrific. It sounds like an amazing experience. Thank you all so much for sharing those experiences with us. We've been talking with Paul Primak, He is with AFS American Field Services. We've been talking to Iruna Chopuk, an exchange student here in Eugene from Ukraine, and talking to Renata Russell, who lives in Eugene, who had an exchange student opportunity in France. Thank you all again for sharing your experiences with us.
ALL: Thank you, Michael.
MICHAEL DUNNE: That's the show for today. All episodes of Oregon On The Record are available as a podcast at KLCC.org. Monday on the show, you'll hear about Bushnell University's acquisition of part of the old PeaceHealth University District hospital. I'm Michael Dunne, host of Oregon On The Record, thanks for listening.
